Veronica Nabizadeh – Love, Law, and Lifelong Lessons

In this insightful episode, Veronica Nabizadeh, shares her transformative journey from lawyer to relationship coach. The discussion delves into the role of the subconscious in partner selection and the need to break free from cultural expectations for more conscious relationships. Overall, it offers profound insights into the lessons learned through relationships and the potential for healing and growth.

Grab your copy of the ‘How to Stay Married’ book!

1. Redefining Love & Money: How Relationship Restart is Transforming Marriages and the Economy

2. Love as a Sacred Business: Unlocking Battle-Weary Couples’ Potential

3. Strategies for Love: How an Attorney-Turned-Relationship Expert is Changing the Game

4. The Business of Love: A Strategic Approach to Saving Marriages

5. From Courtroom to Heart Room: Transforming Relationships and Lives

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Hi and welcome to the You World Order Showcase podcast. Today we have with us a very special guest. I've been really looking forward to having this gal on for the longest time. we've met in another program that we were both in together and I just watched her blossom along the way over the last.


I don't know eight or nine months.


So anyway, it's my honor to introduce you to Veronica Nabizadeh esquire, because she is a lawyer turned relationship coach and she is all about helping people.


Have the marriage they want to have. And if you decide that you don't want to stay in that.


Marriage she helps you.


Break up in a way that's empowering to both parties. So welcome to the show. Veronica. I'm so glad that you joined me.


Oh my gosh. Thank you, Jill. And that was so lovely to hear you introduce me to your community. So thank you.


You are welcome. So how did you decide to go from being a lawyer? And what kind of lawyer were you? I know you were helping people with speeding tickets, but beyond that?


Oh my gosh. Well, I'll tell you what I.


I was married 14 years.


But I was married 10.


Years before I had my daughter until we had our daughter, Clara.


And that, you know, she's four years old now. And she says to me.


You and Daddy argue every day. Can you make it stop? And when she told me that.


I it crushed me and I thought here I am an attorney. I'm a highly degreed woman. But I have a child and she's growing up in a toxic environment. And at that moment I made a commitment to fix my marriage or to fix what was wrong with me. And that was my.


Decision and at that point, that's when I.


I learned what was going on in my marriage and I learned from Terry Real. He's this internationally celebrated relationship and family therapist, and I learned the what behind the why we were arguing so much.


Now my daughter is a teenager and she's independent and just so wise beyond her years. And my husband of almost 24 years of marriage is the biggest supporter of the work I do today. But if it wasn't for my daughter to give me that big.


Wake up call. That was my turning point where I knew that I kept my I kept my license like I was saying because it is very helpful to family members who get speeding tickets. But I knew that I once I found what helped me, I knew I did not want to.


To break families apart without helping them first, discover their what behind the why they're driving themselves nuts with arguing and being anti relational with one another. And so I became a divorce mediator. Specifically, after helping people to.


To give them a choice once they've done their work, you know to leave with grace and respect and with dignity. We don't have to armor up to unwind the legal instrument of marriage.


Like what? Like what the culture tells us to do. We want to do what's right for the children. And so I became a divorce mediator. And I'm I feel really proud of being a relationship restart Coach.


I love that. Like I said, I have watched as your.


As your practice has really blossomed and solidified in terms of how you're helping people and.


I've been through a divorce and I respect the.




Dissolution of a marriage if it's not working and.


Image is really a contract and a lot of.


People think it's.


Something else, but ultimately it's a contract that you make between two people and you have things that you agree to, and they have things that they agree to and.


It it's entered into it often kind.


Frivolously, people don't really realize that it's illegal.


It's a legal entanglement, and that's what contracts are. And there's.


There's things that marriage affords people that.


You know.


And marriage isn't for everybody.


You know, and being staying married isn't for everybody.


And usually the way to stay married if you want to stay married is to work on yourself and not expect the other person to change.


Usually the problem.


And so.


Yeah, I mean, you're singing words to a song that I sing all the time, you know, in in law, in business, there is a agreement. And one of the first parts of the agreement is a meeting of the mind.


That is often not what happens when people get married. We don't have an agreement or an understanding. A lot of it is expectation or cultural. A lot of it is stunted and it's not. And who? Who teaches us how to communicate our needs. You know, we've picked up really bad.


Adaptations along the way that maybe work back in the day when we were in grade school, but they don't work now that we're.


Married and growing a family.


So I you know, I wrote a book called How to Stay married by a divorce attorney before you throw in the towel. Because exactly what you said, Jill, when you look at your partner and can drop all the needs and all the expectations.


And you learn how to communicate.


And to Co create you can stay together and thrive, and I can help you with that or you may decide.


Gosh, you know, now that I know what I want and what I want in a marriage and what I'm willing to do and what I'm willing to mourn that that I don't get, I choose, you know, to go ahead and dissolve this legal instrument of marriage. But do what's right for our children.


That we've birthed together and I know that I am a parent for the rest of my days here on Earth. And I want to be an attuned parent. And I've learned all the my lessons. I, you know, from the pain of my marriage. So I'm moving forward in a whole and complete way.


OK, understanding that I am always going to be part of a family, whether I'm legally, you know, tied to them or not. The sacredness of that family still continues.


It never. It never ceases. I have two kids with my first husband. I'm still in communication with him. It's been almost 30 years since.


We were divorced and we were together for 13 years before that it was, and it wasn't.


It was painful, but it wasn't horrible. When we got divorced, I did not want to go to court and fight with him about anything, so I just gave him everything. I left the kids with him. I left the house with him. I left everything with him and then after the pain, kind of subsided a little bit, then we were able to negotiate some of the other pieces that.


Made life easier for everybody, but.


Everybody had a say in it. It wasn't just like, you know, moms done and.


We're going to blow up the whole family, and I mean, you do end up blowing up a family when? When?


You do that but.


The best things you can do are not to like, disparage the other person.


Because your kids.


Are part of both of.


You they're not one or the other. And when you start chipping at that other person, then they're like so.


This is the part of me you don't like.


Because you know what else are they?


Going to think.


So I.


I didn't mean to cut you off, Joe, but that's so beautiful that that 43 years you've been in a relationship with your was been. I'd love that. And you know your decision then worked for you and it was. Hey, right now let's just make it easy because it's really too painful otherwise.


And that was intuitively a really smart thing to do, and then to go back when you got level headed.


So that you can make a plan and you can do things.


And it worked for.


You and it's really smart when a mother can say or when any parent can say that kid is a part of both me and their father, and I can't disparage part of my kid who who's, who's has. No.


Well, I was going to say who didn't have any decision making in the in selecting the parents, you know, but if we go into the spiritual well we might go on.


To left field but.


You know, you know the kid is innocent and he's comprised of his self and of his parents and it's really respectful and responsible that you chose to take the High Road and so many of them don't. So many you know I had a friend recently. He was visiting Spain.


She said that divorce rate in Spain now she was in.


I can't remember. It was Barcelona or some other city and she said that the newspaper and she's going to get me a copy of it and it showed a divorce rate of 80%.


And here and. Yeah, and here which is OK, but how many of them are done consciously?


How many of them are done with dignity and with grace, even beyond amicable? It's like, hey, we are parting ways, but we're not partying. The fact that you are a part of my life because we have this child forever, you're going to be around for the holidays, for the births of our children's, for graduations.


For you know like.


It just and that person is tied to.


You for the forever.


You know, so it's like, yeah.


There's, there's not a lot you can do about it, and even when your kids are older, like my kids are in their 40s, some of them and my current husband, you know, when we go to California, we.


We get together.


My husband gets along fine with my ex-husband and they share the same birthday.


Wow, I wonder are they similar in personality or? I mean, they're charts are that are this really close to each other?


They're six years apart.


But they were born on the same exact same day, which I don't know.


It says more about them or.


Me. You have this whole contract with whatever they came to came down with, you know.


Yeah. And I do believe in soul contracts and I do believe the kids that are born into these relationships, they're born into it for a reason. There's something they're supposed to learn and.


Painful though a lot of.


These things can be they're.


They're going to learn what they're going to learn and it's their journey. It's not mine. And you know, as a as a parent, you want to make things easier for your kids.


There's going to be trauma.


We all you.


You don't escape childhood without some sort of trauma.


Ohh gosh.


I that's what I tell everyone. Like, trauma is not. What's the word. Like it doesn't care. It's non discriminatory.


You know.


You're either going to get traumatized inadvertently or intentionally at home.


And if you are lucky enough not to have that at home, then when you go to school, it's going to happen there like it's going to happen somewhere. And I came to that conclusion like, Oh my God, if we all get traumatized. OK. So I guess it's just a universal thing that happens to all human beings, and that must be for, you know.


Once we live in an infinite, you know, helpful and benevolent universe, it must be for our higher purpose and good, you know, and so.


I just came to that, that dawning on my own. But it's what everyone all the great leaders and transformational leaders and masters all talk about that we, you know, we learn through friction and the moment that we surrender and we feel our feelings.


And we glean the wisdom from our feelings, and then we release it. You know, we're the better for it.


You know, and I remember hearing, like, I remember when I first heard that from I can't remember who maybe Michael Singer. When I first read his book, years and decades.


You go and I was like you. I'm going to be happy because of this tragedy that happened to me. Like I'm going to be better for it. And then now I can.


Look back and.


I can go. Oh, my God. I don't want it to happen again, but I am certainly better because of that.


It's the lessons we learn and you know, if we can, if we can look at the trauma and.


And I.


Not let it like.


Impacting us, I think we get into trouble as.


Human beings when we.


When we steep in the trauma and we don't like move away from it and we can't look at the lessons that we learned from it and appreciate it, it's I think in the gratitude for the challenge it.


So long as.


We remain a victim of the situation or the whatever happened to us.


Then we're always looking on the outside for somebody to rescue us, but once we step into our power and we.


Are all powerful. We can all change our minds, and really that's all it amounts to. It's changing your mind about how you view something that happened and it changes the event there's.


There's evidence about this. Ohh.


Because we all remember things differently. So you're not even actually remembering what happened. In reality, we create our realities by the way we think and just.


The way you.


Think about it will change.


How the event happened?


It's so it's. So it's so lovely to speak with you about these things because a lot of times I feel like I'm a divorce mediator and a relationship expert. That's I'm actually a spiritual coach that's fronting as a divorce mediator and a relationship restart.


You know, because these deeper conversations, it's for me. It's what it's all about and personal development.


I know, like when I look back at my life, what is my Dharma? It's everything I've been doing. No matter if I was depressed or working too much or whatever. I have always been in personal development and I wrote this book called How to Stay married by a divorce attorney and it has nothing to do with the law except towards the end.


That helps you think if you're in a situation where maybe we're are going to split ways how to kind of get yourself grounded into that decision and to how to prepare, you know, with respect.


To per you know, money and finances and marital property and all that stuff and how you want to raise agreement on this. So there's things that you can do on your on your own just as a as a conversation. Oh man, I lost my train of thought. What was, where was I going with that?


Personal development and having.


Personal development it's all about looking at your marriage struggles as a mirror and I have. I always normally have a mirror with me whenever I'm by my desk as a mirror, as a mirror reflecting back to me. The things that I don't like about myself or the things that are within me.


That are stored that I haven't handled. And like you're saying, if people can just change their perspectives and that is why I love my stop, drop and roll baby boot camp course that's coming up. I developed a course because, you know, when my daughter was like Mommy, please make it stop.


Up I was like.


OK. How do I?


Stop arguing. I mean, I am right. If my husband would change, I wouldn't have to prove myself. I wouldn't have to, you know, do these. I wouldn't have to be arguing. And losing my starts in front.


Of my kid.


And so you know that, you know that did you grow up in the states in the 70s?


No, but I know what you're talking about.


OK, the stop, drop and roll that was taught to elementary kids, you know, to stop fueling the flames and drop to the floor and protect your face and your head and then roll in a blanket or a carpet.


Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.


So you can.


Put out the flames and that is also it works. This technique works when couples are on fire too, and so when the fire is stopped.


You know, and the cortisol is relaxed. We actually can change our perspective once we're rolling into self-care. And so this how I teach it is the stopping and the dropping our acts of self love and the self-care is.


Is the rolling into your wholeness. That's when you meditate. That's when you go hug a tree and get grounding. That's when you reach out to a coach or to someone that you trust that can help you. That's where you, you know, you, you lavish your body with prana foods you know with.


You're not drinking alcohol and numbing yourself. You know you're taking care of yourself so you can have access to what we are equipped with a relational mind. We are equipped with a relational mind, but the problem is.


The rubber meets the road in relationships and that is our, you know, I learned from Helen Harvill, Helen and Helen Hendricks and Harvel Hendricks, who wrote.


The book they wrote.


Many books and, but I learned from them that our subconscious picks our partners. It actually winnows out. Not you, not you, because there's how many males and females do we have. So how does it find the one? It's like not him, not him.


Not him, not him.


Oh, Ding, Ding. That's the one. And it's they choose.


Your partner that your subconscious chooses your partner because it's like.


This person is going to give you this approximates all your caregivers and family and you know teachers that traumatized you. And now that you're an adult, you can handle it. You can become whole again. You can reclaim these parts that are still frozen in time, but we didn't get the memo.


Right. We were like so in.


Loves and we had high hopes and then we were like and shrouded with expectations and needs and cultural things and the and you know the multi generational trauma that that we come with too you know they.


This is why divorce is 50% or more in the United States and 80% in Spain. Because we did not learn, we were not told how that we were also going to love and we were also going to heal ourselves through our relationships. And so when we learned to go inwards.


And we stop contributing to the fighting and we drop all our needs and expectations and we roll into self-care. We then can change our perspective and say, Oh my God, there's a better way.


I don't have to walk on egg shells. I don't have to have World War three just to get my needs met. I don't have to throw a relationship saboteur of blaming and shaming and judging. I don't have to make my husband wrong so he can finally do what I want him to do. Like all that stuff, we can let go, you know, and like when you said earlier.


If we don't just steep in our pain, we can move forward and that's the beautiful thing about our relational brain because we.


Are trained to. We also have this limbic system that's always on the prowl. It's always looking for danger, danger. This is going to be uncomfortable. This is going to be not so hard, you know, not harmonious. And. And then when that happens to the degree that that happens, our relational mind, you know, the neocortex, kind of like.


It loses its stronghold, you know, because it has to make room for the attack.


The defense, and if we were just to feel our feelings and just not invert on ourselves, you know not to, we're we failed again. We lost it again. Or he always does this.


If we can just go God, that sucks.


This is what anger feels like, and in 3 minutes.


The heaviest emotions can actually express themselves out if we don't keep feeding them.


You know, so it's just three minutes. So I was like when I learned that I was like, I got 3 minutes. I can stop, I can stop, and I can drop my relational saboteur. I talk about these seven relationship saboteurs. I can. I can stop that for three minutes. But if I'm for three minutes, if I don't feed it.


You know, and I'm doing some self-care. I'm gonna give myself 3 minutes if I still.


Wanna you know, I'm gonna give myself the right to do that. But I was noticing. And to my surprise, but even more to my husband's surprise that we stopped arguing.


And you know, that was a miracle. Just doing that simple. Stop, drop and roll. So I have this course I teach within the stop drop and roll as the seven relationship saboteurs. Can I just share them with your.


I would love that.


Audience OK.


So I studied with Terry Reel, who I'm just I, you know, the teacher appears when the student is ready. Thank you. I got I think I got the best teacher and he talks about 5 losing strategies and that that happen or occur within a struggling union.


And I took them as my own and then added three, two more to them, and I call them the relationship saboteurs.


And this is what I did stopping and there's different levels of stop, drop and roll. I have a level one and then a Level 2 and then you know a Level 3. So basically it's for the battle weary wife.


Who has children and she's struggling with her husband, who refuses to go to therapy. She can stop. She's battle weary, right? She can stop, drop and roll and change their perspective. And the condition of her marriage without her husband doing Jack.


****. Pardon my French and it is so powerful that we get to step into our.


Our leadership for our children and even for our husband, you know, cause we're not taking it personally. So the seven relationship saboteurs that once I learned them and there's nuances to them. But once I learned them and I dropped them, I was able to change my perspective. And the first one or they're not in any particular order, but it's being controlling.


And a version of control with walking on egg shells. I'm trying to control the outcome of my from my husband, so I'm going to walk on egg shells. I stopped doing that so.


So no more controlling, can't control, another adult can't. And then yeah, it doesn't work and stop being defensive because I don't have to protect myself from my husband. He loves me. I love him. I don't have to. I'm dropping my defensive. I don't have defenses. I don't have to defend myself inside my marriage.


I don't have to do that. And then I stopped blaming, shaming and judging him.


UMI stopped the unbridled use of self-expression.


You always do this. You're never on time like I just stopped it because it's not. It doesn't work. And so, what else? I never really used withdrawal. That's mostly my husband's. That was his big relationship saboteurs. He was withdrawal. He would be dismissive and withdraw. And then I.


Would be needy.


And go after him. And that was like our relational dance, you know, like, very discord.


It and retaliation. You know, there's all kinds of retaliation. There's the simple kind, like, oh, I see. I see. I see his shoelaces not tied. I'm not going to tell him. He deserves to fall. That's an act of retaliation. Or, like, the more egregious retaliations. Well, I slept with my neighbor.


Because he had an affair. You know, I'm just not doing that. So I dropped all seven of those relationships outdoors, and when I self cared, I looked at all the reasons why I got angry and I held the mirror.


And anything that I was accusing my husband with, I went in and said, can I find it? Can I? Did I do that somewhere to myself even? Oh.


Yes, I did. So it's really these profound things to know.


To keep us to, to help us become more sane and therefore happy.


I love them all, and as someone who's been married for 28 years.


Each one of those is crucial to having a successful marriage and being able to look at your spouse and ask yourself the question when you feel the need to like blow up at somebody. Do I just want to be the victim here is that what this is all about?


Because a lot of times it is, you know, when you're, like, washing that dish for the last time, even though you've told them a million times, don't leave dishes in my sink. At some point you just you just got to get over it and let it go and recognize that there's other things that they're doing.


Oh yeah.


That you don't like to do like, you know, maybe the dish is always in the sink.


And maybe there's a reason why it's in this thing, and this is a true story in in my relationship, it's the Mason jar. I buy a wide mouth Mason jars because I can put my hand in them. And so I assume everyone can. But my husband likes to make his shakes in the Mason jar and then he leaves it in the sink too.


Soak as I put in air quotes and every day I wash that stupid thing and every day I think God why?


Can't you just wash it? You're.


Over here anyway, turn the water on.


And I asked him one time because, you know, first you do the you.


Know please wash the dish please.


Wash the dish and that doesn't seem to work. He's just that it's just soaking and.


And then he finally admitted he can't put his hand in the Mason jar.


So when I watched the Mason jar for.


Him it's like it's.


It's an act of kindness because.


He can't do it.


Isn't that lovely?


But I never knew.


That is such a profound truth. You know, like there must be a reason that he doesn't do that. And that curiosity is what I teach. Well, I don't. I mean, I share that curiosity really is our number one universal panacea and relational.


Disharmony. Yeah. You asked him. Like, why? Why don't you know you. You ain't turned on the water. You ready to put soap in there? Like, just the extra step of just, you know, doing little shimmy shimmy and shaky, shaky it. Oh, it's not that easy for me, Jill. My, my big manly hands cannot fit into this jar and then it's like.


And now when you wash it, do you like now? Do you just are, are you just so happy that you?


Didn't lose your shorts.


Yeah. And you get to celebrate in your magnificence that, hey, God, I am so happy.


I didn't lose my.


Shorts for something that's so simple now. Now he is helping me. He's actually doing everything he possibly can and what he can't do, I'm because I'm his wife and I love him. I'm.


Going to take over?


And I just love that you said that. And you also said.


I really love that you said there are some things you just have to get over and I when I when I first met a battle weary wife.


I let her have her day in court and I say it's called an it's a process.


It's a this. It's a that it's a this I just we just let it all out because she's been repressing and holding on to it and just being so aggravated and she's unknowingly victimizing herself with it. But so that.


She has the.


Relational mind to be curious and say why don't you do this? I'm just curious. You've done step one and Step 2, Step 3. This is so easy. Oh, mechanically, it's not possible. Or physically it's not possible. I get it. Oh, thank you for doing all that you're doing. It is just so beautiful.


And to learn to.


Appreciate the things that they are doing. You know, I've had to learn this and there there's a couple of things that my husband does do and that I never have to say anything about. It just magically happens. One of them is putting gas.


In our car.


I haven't put gas in the car in.


Months. He just always fills the car up. Yeah, he does drive it most of the time, but.


I just I never get in the car.


It's always glass when you need it.


I never get in the car.


And find it, you know, running out.


Of gas, there's always gas when I need to use.


The car and.


The other thing is taking the trash out I.


He was a truck driver, so he's gone all the time and so I would always have to take the trash out, you know.


Did all the dishes to clean.


And to take the.


Trash out and mow the lawn and he mows the lawn now.


I mean I.


It sounds like these are little simple things, but they're huge things in my life. They sucked up a lot of my time.


Well, like the appreciation that you are sharing with me is so beautiful because that is part.


Of cherishing, and we forget to do that. And you know you are not about a weary wife, so you are accessing your love and you are being appreciating which is an arm of cherishing and you are also celebrating.


When you kept it together and stayed in curiosity because you could have been upset, you could have lost your shorts, but you didn't. You're celebrating your own magnificence, and it really is. It really is appreciating your partner and appreciating oneself.


You know for the choice because we are always equipped with choice points on planet Earth or the school like Earth School, we have free will.


You know and.


I really would like to spend the rest of my life making the best choices whenever those choice points come my way. And I now know what's important to me. My husband is the most my husband and my daughter are the two most important people in my life, so they get my relational brain.


They get.


You know, before it used to be my clients, my neighbors, the people on the supermarket line or the bank, you know, they would get the best.


Of me and.


And the two most importantly, get the worst of me. But I reverse that. Well now, now that.


My life is.


So now that we have a sacred family.


I bring that love everywhere, you know? But first it starts with me and my the people that I just absolutely adore so.


You said something else really brilliant, and I'm just so happy to talk to someone who's not a relationship coach. But doing the smart work and you celebrate what is right in your relationship and it's so brilliant, Jill. And so many people were programmed because of our limbic system and because our.


Of our, you know, the sonar that's looking for any kind of danger. We're programmed to look at the negative.


But when you are smart and you're, I say wise when you're wise enough to go, what is right? My husband always fills the gas tank. If it's 3:00 in the morning or 8:00 in the morning, I never have to worry about having a gas that's empty. Your gas tank. That's empty. That.


Is so much peace.


And security. And it's also it's it, it promotes.


You know peace and it it's it stops chaos, you know, like who? We're always running late and Oh my God, we gotta get gas too, you know? So it's like it's a it's a big gift, you know, and taking out the trash at night when there's you know we live in a place where we have a lot of wild animals. And so I like that.


Your husband takes it. I mean, it's and that you were. I like even more than you appreciate that he's taking out the trash. Like you don't have to ask him. It's just.


Fun. And it's so beautiful. So I always, you know, when my. When my wife comes to me. I'm like, why did you marry him? And they're always surprised.




You know, but it's like we have to remember that we loved our husband, you know, and we have to celebrate what is right. And we have to ask for our needs to be met when there are stuff that's not so right and.


If it's impossible because of some physical thing or limitation, or some, you know mechanical thing, then we mourn what we don't have because we have so much. And then and then we know from all the greats, all the masters, the Ascended Masters and all the beautiful transformational people. They tell us we need nothing.


From no one we have everything. We have all that we need.


So when we come, when we wake up to that fact.


Then it's a it's. How can I cherish you? How can we enjoy each other as we are both, you know, facing life as it unfolds for us? Sometimes it's scary. Sometimes it's hard. How can we be supportive in our in our code journeys as we Co create the life that we want to have?


So I love everything that you're saying.


And I think.


You made.


A an interesting point there when you're talking about.


Doing your own personal work.


We were taught when I was young that you know when you got married it was 2 halves coming together to be a whole. I don't think that's true. I think it's two holes coming together to make a strong bond. 2 individuals who are perfectly capable in their own right of doing everything that they need to do.


To be a human being, to, you know, feed themselves and clothe themselves. And you know how.


Life and when two whole people come together, they're not broken. They don't have to stand and lean on each other because you know that other person is not your crutch. He's your partner and two partners that are equally, you know, talk about equally yoked that are.


Are matched. They're a good match and sometimes.


You know you.


Marry young and you're not a good.


Match. Get over it and move on. Somebody else is out there. That is a good match for you. Go find that person. Don't try to just, like, drag it on and on and on for the kids sake, because all you're going to do is damage those kids too, because you're going to teach them.


To be disempowered so.


Make the decision.


But recognize that it's not about being.


Half a person.


You need to be a whole person. You need to know.


Who you are.


And what you're about and what your values are and what your standards are, and it all goes back to, you know, marriage is a contract.


Have some hard conversations with this person while you're in the lovey dovey stage, you know.


What? What are your expectations for this relationship? What do you hope to get from me? Do you? Do you envision us growing old together? Have you ever thought about what it's going to be like when one of us is injured or can't do stuff or you know?


What's that going to?


Look like because we're not always going.


To be young.


Yeah, that's absolutely beautiful. All of what you said is beautiful. And you know, when I think of back to the two become one to become, to become two and honor the space between, you know.


The two.


You know what I did?


And I'm not. I'm not begrudging myself, but I'm hoping that maybe there's. I'm, I'm wondering. My intention is to speak to that Lady who was just like me, who had all these expectations.


That when she got married, her life would get started. You know, when I married my husband. Oh, my God. Poor God. I had put so much expectations on him to meet so many of my needs that only I could complete and fulfill myself. And I love that you said.


That you brought this up because when I came to my marriage, I was like Swiss cheese. I was not a whole and complete. I had all these holes and I was looking at him to fill him. And he was like.


Well, you know, after the Lovey dovey stage. Holy crap. You know, this is way too, exactly, you know? And so yeah, it when two whole individuals come together, it is they sharing of love and the actual Co creation.


Of a life together and like you say, if it doesn't workout because you know when you pick your partner.


You were young, you know. It's like alright, we just need to separate because I don't want to be with you anymore. But I don't want to. I don't mean you.


Any bad will?


I just, you know, you're we're better off you going this way and me going this way, you know? So I think that's just that that comes unless we have.


Upbringing where we are around wise and loving adults who are or who are choosing full respect, living.


We can make those kinds of decisions, you know, we can have those kinds of conversations. In fact, we pull in people to the degree at which how whole we are. So as Swiss wholly as I was my husband was 2, just different holes, you know, he, he I had different holes. He had different holes but.


We were pretty equal.


In our holes, you know, we were not too whole beans.


I had to learn that.


And I'm really proud. I'm really proud.


That I did that for myself and I did that for my daughter and I did that for my husband, who now.


Has the freedom.


To do his own work.


You know, because I did mine and our love that we share is so deep and so sweet.


And I just want that for everyone.


I couldn't be more proud of you. It's really.


It's it doesn't happen very often that people recognize that, hey, it starts with me and until I do something about me, I can't really expect anything to change around me.


Because ultimately.


The life and the reality that we create.


Starts in our heads.


And it's.


What we're thinking about and the decisions we make impact the way that we live our lives, the way reality forms around us and we can change it and it may not.


Change on the outside immediately, but it will change. It's. It's the whole reaping and sewing thing. You don't sew in the same.


Season that you reap.


They make different decisions and a little bit down the road. You'll start to see the fruit of those better decisions.


You're still going to suffer the consequences of your other decisions, but make better decisions. You'll have a better life.


That's so beautiful. And I wrote an ebook called the Sacred Pause for the Battle Weary Wife.


And I wanted.


To share that with you and also your.


Because if you're if a, if you're in a relationship where you don't know WTF happened and you can't get a grip on your emotions and you're raising a kid or children and you're feeling anxious and depressed, well, what and?


I also did not come from a family that was steeped in the tradition of going to church every Sunday. You know, my dad was like.




My dad had.


These ideas about church that were, you know, if you don't walk a tight rope or a tight line, then you're kind of outcast or you're judged. And so he didn't want any part of that. And my mom, you know, wasn't very biblical or religious.


So I my religion came to me and my spirituality and religion came to me pretty early on in life when my sister was killed in a car accident and she was 17 and I was 19 and I knew at that point.


I cannot be alone. I know that I I'm not supposed to be on this earth suffering to this degree without any help. There has to be help and so there. When I was 19 is when I became a Buddhist, you know, and. And then eventually I studied. I studied religion.


I went to India for a month. I met gurus.


You know, but I wrote this ebook for the battle where your wife, who is not it, doesn't have a place to call, doesn't have a spiritual home or, you know, and I it is what I did to help me after my daughter.


And begged me to stop to make the arguing stop. It's what I did to help me return home to myself.


And to be able to change my perspective and to be able to be an attuned mother and to be a spiritual leader for my family. So it's what I did. It's they're techniques and the things that I've done that I did that helped me become more resourced.


And I heard somebody say something recently. I don't know who it was, but some great person said.


When you're connected to source and you said this too, you're like, we're disempowered. I feel like the moment we lose connection to source, we do become disempowered. But when we're connected to source and we reconnect, we're resourced, you know, so let's


Resourced and so my sacred pause ebook is for the battle weary wife who wants to re empower herself and connect herself to her truth. And it's what I did that helped me.


Ah, gain my sanity and gain control over my life, my inner life, and my outer life too. As much as I'm. I'm supposed to take care of. That's the business that's mine. I got that. Everything else and my God, it's yours that's on you. Traffic that's on you. Client. You know what clients come to me.


That's on you. You know, if the Internet goes down, you know.


But how I respond? How I how I maintain my inner ecosystem of peace and love. That's up to me. And I take that responsibility. I choose full respect. Living. I choose to stay open. I choose to be a light for others, and it is surprisingly.


I am meeting a whole bunch of light leaders and when I teach them what I do, they.


Go. Oh my.


God, I still do that. I'm like, yes, we don't know what we're doing is creating havoc in our.


Marriage it is OK, but once you know the truth of what we do, then you. And if you choose not to, then you're going to be the effect.


Of it, you know, so it's like, here's the road. It's simple. It's three things. Stop, drop, roll. Super easy.


But it's always a choice to do.


I love that you make it so.


Easy because it really.


It doesn't need to.


Be hard not trying to complicate.


Everything in life and it just.


Really, the whole art of being present.


It's simple, just like.


What's going to happen later?


No. Maybe it will, maybe it won't.


Let's be curious and see what happens.


You familiar with rombas?


OK, he's this really an interesting fellow. I hope I Get the facts right, but he was a I believe either a Harvard professor or maybe he was a student at Harvard and he was working with the psychedelics, LSD and.


He was gaining a lot of recognition and people were having, like major healings and he went to India and he met a guru, Maharishi.


Yogi, I'm not really familiar. I can't remember the name of his guru and he was so smart. He was so intellectual. He was so brilliant. The girl gave him a Shakti pot which I believe means he basically helped him have an out of body experience and he took. He took his soul out of his body and it just enough to get him.


Out of his head of he was really brilliant.


And he came back a changed man. And he wrote this book called Be Here now. And it's like a really big best selling book. And he's no longer with us. He dropped his body. I want to say maybe in 2014 or 2015. And he's read he's also love here. Now he's written several books and he has quite a following.


But when I came up with stop drop roll when I saw that I was like.


I can do that, I can stop contributing to the arguing. I can drop all my needs and all the relationships out of tours, and I can roll myself into self-care and change my perspective and therefore be better because of it and be better for myself, be better for my child.


Be better for my family so I get a little carried away.


When I talk about this because it's just.


So simple and brilliant, you know.


It is. It is.


And how could?


People find you, Veronica. If they wanted to.


OK, so they can find me on and if you go to you can get one of two things. One, you can download my sacred pause for the battle where we wife book.


Then you can also sign up for alerts to receive alerts of the publication of my book, how to Stay married by a divorce attorney. That is probably coming out like I have my book outline. I'm done with my book by the end of this year. I have proof readers.


And I have to give my book to several people so they can write their praise worthy testimonial of my book and then my publisher just needs three months to do what they do so that I believe all you know, in God's hands it would be published in the 2nd.


The second quarter of next year.


So once this episode drops, it's going to be real soon, people, so be looking for it. I am really looking forward to reading that Veronica I.


Thank you. I think it's going to be spectacular.


And I have a stop, drop, roll, baby boot camp. Now I do have one coming up on January 19th of 2024, but I also will be having a stop drop, roll baby boot camp.


For the next, I say I'm going to have it pretty regularly. Every month after that, but I'm not going to charge for it. It's free. So if you make this available to your people after my initial boot camp of next year, then if they want to join for free when ioffer it in February.


All they have to do is mention Jill Hart and they can come to my boot camp for completely free so they get a sacred pause ebook for the battle weary wife and it's all for only females only for wives with children married to husbands that refuse therapy and.


And then they get to have the free.


Stop, drop, roll, baby boot camp.


Perfect. Perfect. And.


We'll make sure that.


We put that.


In the show notes so that people can.


Come and join you. I think this is going to be amazing. So what's the one thing you.


Thank you.


Want to leave the audience with today?


Stop contributing to the arguments. Drop the relationship saboteurs, which are, I'll repeat, being controlling, being defensive, withdrawing.


Blaming, shaming, or judging? Retaliating did I get him? How many was that?


Ohh and drop the drop the unbridled self-expression. So drop those and roll into self-care and read my book so if you don't have these spiritual or self-care practices you can at least follow the ones that I did that helped me save my sanity.


That's awesome. Thank you so much for joining me. I knew this was going to be.


A great call.


Thank you. And the pleasure is all mine. Jill, thank you so much.

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